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1. "Enduring dislike from women"? No, from pro-abortion fanatics. It is really dishonest of The Age to portray all women as if they support abortion.

   Posted By: Mike

2. The line "Abbott drew enduring dislike from women" paints Tony Abbott as being opposed by all women when in fact it was only a handful of the usual rabid, feminist, self-annointed "elite".

   Posted By: John FG McMahon

3. This article is loaded against Tony Abbot, juxtaposing his opposition to abortion against his alleged sexual concerns and accusing him of "smouldering" ambitions.
   At least the writer admits that Abbot in forthright and tough both pthysically and mentally.
   The suggestin that his opposition to Malcolm Turnbull runs deeper than the ETS is probably right but it might not be so much about ambition as to the fact that turnbull's record on mortal issues close to catholicim;s heart is far lesss impressive than Abbot's.
   Catholicim doesn't have one sert of teachings for liberals and another for conservatives. You either stand up for the teachings of the church or you don't. Tony Abbot, to his eternal credit, does.

   Posted By: Robert

4. Abbott is not even in the chair and the critics are lining up. What is the point of mentioning, out of context, the apparent "celibacy adviser" during his time as a trainee priest" if not in an attempt to scare readers with a supposed skeleton in the closet - from decades ago mind you.
   I know I am expecting too much for the media to argue the actual rationale behind Abbott's supposed view on sex or whatever else the author has his own personal opinions about.
   

   Posted By: Chris Saidou

5. As if the state of religion couldn't get any worse! Its a sad day when it is Messrs Abbott and Turnbull are held up as representative of the polarities of Catholicism.

   Posted By: Mark

6. I admire Tony Abbott for his strength in upholding his Catholic beliefs. However, on this occasion, he is going against God's command to nurture and look after the earth which is God's gift to us. For once, I agree with Malcolm Turnbull's statement that we must provide a cleaner planet for our descendants. I hope and pray that Mr Abbott changes his mind on this matter.
   And what does having a celibacy advisor while training for the priesthood have to do with anything?

   Posted By: Bob

7. Tony Abbott is a very smart man, as is anyone else who follows the traditional Catholic values of Bob Santamaria
   Now It is often stated in legal circles that B.A Santamaria had a very sharp intellect, and that BA had of the best minds to ever to come out of Melbourne university!
   So thanks Tony for always having the courage to stand up for the innocent, voiceless, defenceless, unborn, our future, the next generation.
   You are a man of principle across so many, many spheres.
   Life ain't just for the privileged, the planned, the perfect; nor is it for some trendies who choose to pick up and run on some other issues that have not been clearly scientifically proven beyond reasonable doubt.

   Posted By: catherine KENNEDY

8. What I think we must keep in mind with Tony Abbott is that he does not speak for the Catholic Church, nor for Catholic people. Santarmaria and his supporters infiltrated the ALP and split that party, now his followers are doing the same to the Liberals. Eventually the Liberals will do with thoes Santarmaria people what labor did in the past, get rid of them.
   The final explosion will be when the Catholic church officially seperates itself from the Santamaria connection.
   

   Posted By: kevin vaughan

9. Robert says Tony Abbot is more impressive is his stand on moral issues than Malcolm Turnbull.
   Abbot was a close colleague of Howard, and Howard was responsible for Children Overboard, Tampa, the Pacific Solution, refugees and their children kept in prison conditions for years, war on Iraq based on lies (Weapons of Mass Destruction etc).
   Are these not moral issues? (Or even mortal issues if that's what was meant).

   Posted By: vsquared47

10. Tony Abbot only raised the hackles of the pro-abortion feminists after it became apparent that he could become the leader. Significantly, they believe he is not telling the truth of his opposition to ETS. The so-called scientific basis for man-made global warming is the most abominable pseudo-science that I have ever met in my long career as a scientist. Someone has to stand up to it.

    Posted By: Alex Reichel

11. To suggest that Tony Abbott is disliked by women in the electorate is nonsense.
    I think Tony lost ground over the last few months when he chopped and changed his support for an ETS, and on Tuesday he certainly put his career ahead of the nation when siding with Malcom Turnbull. Besides those moments his support of the conservative women has always been strong.
    The move today to declare his intentions for the leadership will have many rally behind him and with only Joe Hockey (likeable but let's face it a Turnbullite)he will most likely be the new opposition leader come monday.
    I found the statement by Kevin Vaughan "Santarmaria and his supporters infiltrated the ALP and split that party" most amusing and shows just how little Kevin knows on the subject. It's sad that distortions of history can degenerate that much over the years.

    Posted By: Tony Zegenhagen

12. Don't forget that Tony Abbott also drew dislike from women when he initially proposed and argued against Medicare covering the cervical cancer vaccine for young women. His arm was twisted by Howard when he realised that the position was electorally unpopular.

    Posted By: Peter

13. I'm not interested in Tony Abbott's religion in relation to his opposition to Malcolm Turnbull's support of an emissions trading scheme. I'm interested in his grasp of science, generally, & of climate change, in particular. On that point, score 0 for Tony Abbott & 1 for Malcolm Turnbull.
    For a good rundown on the science, go look at the US Environmental Protection Agency website.
    When Tony Abbott was on the Q & A panel with Fr Peter Kennedy, Tony remarked to him, 'Why didn't you just go under the radar?' A revealing comment from a typical highly conservative stance. While the god is in the details of any problem, it's 'good' to pretend the details aren't there.
    Before someone rushes in, to usual conservative/liberal divide, there's an opposite for the highly liberal stance. 'Never look at the big picture. Just chase your favourite detail'
    How did Bob Santamaria get into this discussion?

    Posted By: Marie H

14. Menzies identified the Forgotten People (FP) as a large group of moral people, under attack from smaller sectional groups, and the FP could include any person.
    The ‘social conservatism’ of Howard was couched in being open to change, as long as it ‘conserves’ good things and does not throw out things that are cohesive and beneficial to the “main stream”.
    He adopted effective linguistic contortions on the FP model, reworking it, which enabled him to create a “broader overlapping consensus” for support of continued economic rationalism.
    Tony Abbott would do well to examine the 'Manhattan Declaration', developed By Robert P George and associates recently. And present something similar in Australia (with the assistance of Robert P George). Creating a repetition of the Menzies FP and Howard's 'Main Stream'.

    Posted By: Eamon Hatley-Smith

15. A point which seems to be getting lost here is the distinction between support for a particular piece of legislation - the current proposal for an emmissions trading scheme, and the complete denial that anything needs to be done in terms of precautionary measures regarding emissions and the environment.
    Or to be short, it is just possible that the legislation the Government has proposed is a dog.
    If the problem is as grave as the experts say it is, better to get the legislation right.

    Posted By: Peter

16. Good on you Tony, stand up for what you believe in, "in season and out of season". We are behind you!

    Posted By: Anne

17. So dear Tony has come out and said no to voting against carbon emission. He was interviewed on ABC-TV just recently and said that global warming is not happening. Funny about that, his beloved mentor Howard said the same thing, indeed Howard early on said: "I have looked into this global warming issue, and I have found it just does not exist". Of course he did moderate his words slightly when the election was coming around, alas for him, to no avail.
    How grandiose of these bigotted people, how egocentric to make such childish statements. These gentlemen don't really care about people, children, and the children's children. All they care about is where the next vote is coming from.
    It would appear that John Howard, Tony Abbott, and their kind tend to ignore scientific fact; rather, they regard themselves as oracles, the type that says "listen to me, vote for me, I know what is good for you, a vote for me means more aggrandissment for me. And more importantly, a fatter pension for me when I retire from politics.
    Tony Abbott regards himself as a "good Catholic". I regard him as a person who uses his faith to sway voters to vote for him. A moralist when it suits him to be one, but generally he is a politician.

    Posted By: Dean Williams

18. I would vote for Tony Abbott any day. He is not perfect, but he is the best politician we have. I am proud of him.
    God bless him and give him strength against an ever increasing secular society, which has destroyed our once beautiful country.

    Posted By: Pat

19. Marie H: I personally have not invested much in the climate change debate - many good Catholics support and dissent from what we're told is the scientific orthodoxy - and they're entitled to this, so long as they don't support, for instance, the proliferation of birth control mechanisms.
    Nevertheless, I'd love you to explain the revelations of massive scientific misconduct uncovered by hackers who infiltrated the databases of the University of East Anglia. As I read through the email exchanges of these 'scientists' I soon noticed the ideological (as opposed to rational) reasoning behind the science.
    I would encourage all readers to have a quick look through these leaked exchanges - you will be blown away by the calculated deceit of people we are told and expected to trust as professional scientists.

    Posted By: Aquino

20. Aquino: The hacking of emails does not discredit science, it's simply provided edited examples of certain scientists, in informal conversation, dealing with the fact that all science is provisional.
    Which is why all scientific papers are written in a way that could lead to their being disputed.
    In fact, the state of present knowledge re climate change is actually expressed in terms of what is known, what is likely & what requires more work. Go look at how this is reported on the US Environmental Protection Agency website. You will see how 'What is Known' is reported as having more than a 99% chance of being correct. No, not 100%...which would not be be science which always leaves a window for further study.
    That EPA page also spells out what is likely about climate change (with % of chance)...& then what is not known, presently
    All garnered from reporting across a range of scientific specialties. And all in line with the nature of science.....which is provisional.
    http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/science/stateofknowledge.html
    So anyone expecting total rock-solid unchanging information from the sciences is in the realm of magic, not science.
    And what the 'hacksters' uncovered is nothing new, in relation to the quest for knowledge re climate change. That State of Knowledge context had already been reported & made accessible on the EPA site.
    My background is the sciences & social sciences, where I find the prayer of 13th century St Thomas
    Acquinas apposite:
    "Make me keen to understand, quick to learn, able to remember;
    make me delicate to interpret & ready to speak."
    St Thomas got it right: science consists of ongoing collection & analysis of data & continual interpretation.
    

    Posted By: Marie H

21. If it comes down to a choice between these two men, then it's a simple one for Catholics: Malcolm Turnbull is pro-abortion. Tony Abbott isn't. The decision is obvious.

    Posted By: Paul Keen

22. “Sex has always been something of a touchstone for Abbott. He revealed this year for instance that he had "a celibacy adviser" during his time as a trainee priest”
    This must be the most bizarre and far-fetched attempt ever to create a “sex scandal” out of absolutely nothing. I would be shocked and dismayed to learn that any seminarian did not have anyone to advise him on celibacy. In fact now you mention it, that could well be a major reason why so many seminarians and priests of Abbott’s generation ran off the rails.
    Funny how the media are always saying that people hate Abbott and wouldn’t vote for the Coalition if he was leader; yet Tony Abbott was the only coalition politician who had the voters swing towards him at the last election which saw even the sitting Prime Minister thrown out of his seat.
    And there are no “polarities” in Catholicism, as some commenters have suggested. Metherell is talking about polarities in political views. Some Catholics are less committed and consistent than others. But good Catholics can be found in all political parties (except the Neo-Marxist Greens of course).
    

    Posted By: Peter G

23. Kevin Vaughan’s implication that Tony Abbott claims to “speak for the Catholic Church, and for Catholic people” is ludicrous. Dean Williams’ assertion that Mr Abbott is “a person who uses his faith to sway voters to vote for him”, is even more nonsensical. Tony Abbott has always studiously avoided any suggestion of this. In fact, a couple of years ago he even publicly complained about the media “trying to portray me as Captain Catholic”. In contrast, Turnbull, who converted to Catholicism, hurls his Catholicism at the voters. Check out his website for lots of info and pix of Turnbull as an official ambassador for World Youth Day, meeting the Pope, going to Mass, etc.
    What an amusing attitude Kevin, that anyone who joins and is preselected democratically by a political party has “infiltrated” the party if he happens to have views which you disagree with.
    Dean; I agree that Abbott’s & Howard’s statements on global warming are unscientific, but how on earth are these statements “bigotted” [sic]?
    Peter: There are legitimate scientific and policy concerns, why mass vaccination with the existing flawed HPV vaccine (there is no such thing as a “cancer vaccine”) may not have a nett positive effect. “Women” did not dislike Abbott for pointing this out. In fact, some radical feminists have pointed out the same thing.

    Posted By: Peter G

24. I think Malcolm is a person with strong integrity and loyalty. I think Tony is disloyal and opportunistic.
    It brings to mind a remark by the late Pat Kennearly(he stuttered badly):
    " You have the principles but I have the numbers!"
    

    Posted By: bill

25. Where is Michael Bernard? I have been disappoiunted with his lack of response on Tony Abbott. Does Michael only respond to the really juicy ones of gay clergy and women as equals? Come on, old son, show yourself - give Tony a boost in the polls; God knows he needs it.

    Posted By: Mike b

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