CathNews - a Service of Church Resources

Have Your Say 

Recent Comments

1. I attended an info. night regarding Medjugorje several years ago when we prayed and the chain of my Rosary turned from silver to gold.

   Posted By: josephine

2. Bishop Andrea Gemma may have to take this up with Cardinal Bertone, who wrote in a recent book 'The Last Secret of Fatima' (with Introduction by Pope Benedict) , the following words on the Bishop in charge of Medjugorje ( who is negative about the apparitions) and the current status of the events.
   
   'Bishop Peric's statement expresses a personal opinion of his own. It is not a definitive offical judgment on the part of the Church. The Church defers to the Zara statement issued on April 10,1991, by the bishops of the former Yugoslavia and the statement leaves the door open to further investigations of the affair. So the process of verification needs to move forward.' P 94 'The Last Secret of Fatima' (2008), Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone.
   
   Note: this is from Cardinal Bertone, sober and clear. If he says that Bishop Peric's negative judgement '...is not a definitive official judgement of the Church'- anyone may understand that no final judgement has yet been made - not for, and not against.
   
   Incidentally, another exorcist, Father Gabreille Amorth personally believes the Mejugorje apparitions to be authentic - 'a continuation of Fatima'.
   
   At the very least, the jury is out.

   Posted By: Skye

3. What deceptive words the following are:
   
   'Today, the seers own smart houses with security gates and tennis courts and expensive cars. One is married to a former US beauty queen. '
   
   Having seen where several of the visionaries live - they do not live in the luxury indicated by the above quote; they actually suffer from the media attention which they would prefer to live without. They live with the burden of miunderstanding which often isolates them and makes them suffer. Ivan and his 'former' beauty queen are quiet, prayerful people, role models for Catholic family life. Yes she is a former beauty queen, who now shares Ivan's prayer life and the vicissitudes of his daily life. One should not be so quick to judge and condemn without knowing the people involved. Pope John Paul II was happy to meet several of the visionaries and did not condemn them in this way.

   Posted By: Skye

4. Of course it is. Anyone who has read extensively about it knows that Our Blessed Lady would not appear "on tap" over 40,000 times just for a bunch of money-making publicity seeking puppet-style "apparition" operators. Furthermore, she would not pray The Our Father as that would be ridiculous and she would never say that all religions are equal in the sight of Almighty God because they are not. The fact that there are priests who have wilfully disobeyed their calling (and one in particular has impregnated a nun and still practises his priesthood although he has been suspended) iilustrates its diabolical nature. The fact that they encourage pilgrimages which are officially forbidden by The Vatican and the fact that priests have written books about it defending it, demonstrate irreparable division that can only be from the Devil. This is all about making money on a vast scale; disobedience to properly constituted authority on the matter (two successive bishops of Mostar) and luxurious lifestyles of the fake "seers". Read Michael Davis' book on it and compare The Catholic Church's criteria for private revelations and it is quite clear that Medjugorjie is a fraud. The sooner this scam is exposed publicly for what it is, the better for the Church.

   Posted By: HMacK

5. If Medjugorje has been bearing bad fruit, our former POPE JOHN PAUL II would not have expressed his wish to go there; that he would have gone there had he not been the POPE. (Please read his Biography).
   
   With due respect, I'd like to disagree with Bishop Gemma's assessment, which is unfortunate at best. It's disappointing your article did not EXPLAIN the exact reasons for Bishop Gemma's damaging claim.
   
   From the outset, shall I mention that since the alleged apparitions are still ongoing, the Vatican would NOT be issuing a definitive conclusion on Medjugorje yet. This is common knowledge.
   
   I have travelled to Medjugorje twice - once in 1994 (with my Mum and sister) and again in 2004 (with my family, including our two boys).
   
   Even though I did not go with the intention of seeing any miracle (and I did not see any physical miracles), it has been an uplifting and enriching experience. I experience CHANGES within myself - my FAITH became STRONGER.
   
   It is our human limitation that cannot grasp the urgency of Our Lady's message in Medjugorje and hence cannot grasp the thousands of times of Her daily apparition. Who are we to say God, in all His power, would not allow Our Blessed Lady to appear to us daily? Is it because of our LACK OF FAITH?
   
   
   

   Posted By: Grace

6. Medjugorjie has generated many myths - Pope John Paul II (RIP) never visited the place but steered diplomatically past it when he was in the region on a papal tour of his. And he never approved of it the glowing terms fondly but mistakenly claimed by the Medjugorjie sycophants. Many of these notions are pure fantasy. This is a story that has already generated far too many fables.

   Posted By: HMacK

7. The Church has made it quite clear that we do not need to believe in private revelations for salvation. On this basis alone Medjugorjie is superfluous. However, we already have apparitions of Our Blessed Lady approved by The Church for worthiness of belief at La Salette, Lourdes, Fatima and Akita. These have absolutely nothing to do in any way at all with the Medjugorjie manipulations. In fact, the Akita messages warn of internal divisions among the church hierarchy of a grave nature which in fact we do witness today; She warns of the evidence we compromise the faith too much and fall into idolatry and the warnings of terrible punishments for our sins as a consequence. Indeed, this is in the same vein as Fatima and La Salette already approved. And to those whose lives have allegedly been changed visiting Medjugorjie - my life was changed when I visited the Victoria Falls many years ago when I could not comprehend how wonderful Our Creator and God was in the physical world around us but Our Blessed Lady has not appeared there as far as I know. Also, my visits to the approved lieus Fatima, Walsingham and Lourdes have also changed my life & the lives of many others without disobeying The Vatican in so doing. Frankly speaking, there are many legitimate lieus that may have beneficial influences on our lives. However, this does not necessarily mean that they are places of such supernatural significance as Lourdes or Fatima. Much of the talk is pure emotionalism characteristic of our experiential and oversensitive era. Remember the Devil can simulate what he likes such as watches revolving backwards or even appear momentarily like Our Blessed Mother but with significant differences. When we are overemotional we can imagine almost what we please. In this case, some people are being extremely over-imaginative in an entirely dishonest manner.

   Posted By: HMacK

8. I don't believe a word of Medjugorje. The messages of Our Lady at Fatima and Lourdes are diametrically opposed to the convenient new theology 'our lady' is making at Medjugorje. Religious indifferentism is on offer, along with finicky types of fasting requests and too many hoops to jump to be a Medjugorjian. It just doesn't ring true.

   Posted By: Michael Webb

9. No offence but this article was obviously written by an IDIOT.Maybe you should get your geography right first before you even start writing about Medjugorje.Medjugorje is not in Bosnia, the seers are not "Bosnian".They are from Herzegovina.
   There is a reason the country is called Bosnia and Herzegovina.

   Posted By: Drazenko

10. A comment to HMack'...Our Blessed Lady would not appear "on tap" over 40,000 times'
    
    How do you know? Are you limiting God? Are you saying he couldn't do it?
    
    Actually, when the daily apparitions were occurring for three of the visionaries they were always constant encouragements for them to continue to deepen the spiritual life. A swimming trainer might say similar things thousands of times, without which his charges would not become the champions they are. Our Lady said to the visionaries, that in a dark world, which has forgotten prayer, she had come to teach people to pray again. If we look around, we can see the 'spiritual desert' she referred to and can see that the world is in constant need of prayer and Our lady's 5 point plan - the Mass, prayer, fasting, monthly confession and daily rosary. A simple plan - is there anything wrong with it? - and the visionaries have taken it to heart and are models of good Catholic family life and the strong prayer life in Medjugorje just grows stronger with time.
    
    And do you dare to say that the spiritual and physical miracles which occur there come from Beelzebub? And where do you get your information from? And from where do you say the entire healing of Rita Klaus - at Medjugorje - from Multiple sclerosis ( which she had suffered from for 25 years) - came from? And the Sydney priest, an honest man of integrity greatly respected in the community who personally told me of his 'unhappy' arrival in Medjugorje on 13th October one year, having been diverted from his trip to Fatima, only to see the entire sky light up and to see the sun 'dance' across the sky after he prayed for some confirmation that something was going on there. He understandably was stunned - and where do you say his conviction comes from? Do you really know? And where do you say the miracles I experienced there came from?
    
    Better to take the advice of Gamaliel in the New Testament - if it is not from God it will fall away and you need not worry, if it is from God do not speak so much against it for you will be speaking against the work of God himself.
    
    
    

    Posted By: Skye

11. Answer my other emails Mr Skype - Our Blessed Lady has appeared at approved sites where the message is entirely Catholic and does not deviate from Holy Scripture or from orthodox church teaching. You want to imagine false teachings from other places - that is your privilege but many of us will remain with authentic and authoritative Catholicism.

    Posted By: HMacK

12. Almighty God does not repeat the same message 40,000 times, if you read The Bible. He says it once and if people do not listen then He gets on with His intentions. Also, God does not tell us that all religions are equal, otherwise He would not have destroyed the Temple twice due to idolatry of The Chosen People and He established One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism and One Way and One Truth and One Life, all through Jesus and His only established church on Earth. The others are all false and this has been taught as such until the last 40 years in spite of the Vatican pastoral Councils.
    
    We are talking about faith here not an over-vivid imagination.

    Posted By: HMacK

13. HMacK, the Church continues to teach that all other religions are false insofar as they depart from the truths revealed by Christ through His Church. Vatican II said nothing to contradict this. Do not be misled by those who claim that Vatican II said or authorised many things which it plainly did not. Tell them to read its documents. Most people who claim this have not done so, except for a couple of fragments which they continually and misleadingly quote out of context.

    Posted By: Ronk

14. My opinion after reading and studying the Medjugorje apparitions and its messages is that it is a hoax. And in the words of Father Malachi Martin, "it was satanic from the beginning". I believe its purpose goes beyond a money-making scheme. I believe satan has plans to use this apparition to lead its believers to following something very dangerous as the coming New World Order and the One World Religion. Be careful!!!

    Posted By: Susan Calheno

15. The article's unclear. The reporter states in the first paragraph that the exorcist says the apparitions are a "diabolical deceit", but the quote from the exorcist states that the commercial culture that grew up around the apparitions is a "diabolical deceit" Big difference.

    Posted By: Joe

16. About Medjugorje: I think you know what the tree is from its fruit. The fruit of Medjugorje is Prayer, Fasting, Confessions. I have been there twice and you feel the peace of soul. One can almost feel the mantle of Our Lady all over the place

    Posted By: Elizabeth

17. Apparently this story comes out every year around the time of the anniversary of Medjugorje, and I am told with the same false assertions; and also that Catholic News has been asked to make a retraction on different occasions but this appears to have no effect since the same story is repeated.
    
    I have been advised that everyone should just go by what the Bishops conference and the Holy See have said - that nothing has changed since then and Medjugorje is in their hands. Their ruling, which has still not changed, is that Medjugorje is a Holy Place and a shrine.
    
    The fruits from Medjugorje are what will lead to its being approved at the appropriate time, if it is God's Will.

    Posted By: Frank

18. Frank's comments, while typical of Medjugorjists are not accurate. It behoves a site like CN to post accurate information.
    
    CWNews.com Report
    Medjugorje apparition claims are divisive, bishop warns
    
    Jul. 04, 2006 (CWNews.com) - The Catholic bishop whose diocese includes the town of Medjugorje has warned that "something similar to a schism" has arisen at the parish church where apparitions of the Virgin Mary are alleged to take place.
    
    In a homily delivered in Medjugorje on the feast of Corpus Christi, Bishop Ratko Peric of Mostar-Duvno, in Bosnia-Herzegovina, said that both he and his predecessor have expressed severe misgivings about the reported apparitions. He added that both Pope John Paul II (bio - news) and Pope Benedict XVI (bio - news) backed the judgments of the local bishops.
    
    In his homily Bishop Peric explained that-- "while recognizing the Holy Father's right to give a final decision" on the validity of the reported apparitions-- he doubted their validity. He recalled that when he discussed the reports from Medjugorje with Vatican officials, including then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger at the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, they shared his incredulity.
    
    "They particularly do not seem to be authentic," the bishop observed, "when it is known before that these so-called 'apparitions' will occur." Bishop Peric cited the schedule that the Medjugorje seers have provided, listing the times and places at which they claim the next visits by the Mother of God will occur. Thousands of messages from Mary are now claimed, and the bishop observed that "the flood of so-called apparitions, messages, secrets, and signs do not strengthen the faith, but rather further convince us that in all of this there is nothing neither authentic nor established as truthful."
    
    The first reported appearances of the Virgin at Medjugorje occurred just over 25 years ago. During the 1980s, thousands of Catholic flocked to the little town, with many reporting profound spiritual experiences. These pilgrimages were eventually slowed by the violent bloodshed that tore through the region in the 1990s and by the increasingly public skepticism of the hierarchy.
    
    Bishop Peric reminded his people of the restrictions that he has imposed on activities in Medjugorje. The parish church is not formally a "shrine," he said, and should not be characterized as such. Pilgrimages to the church are discouraged. Priests there are "not authorized to express their private views contrary to the official position of the Church on the so-called 'apparitions' and 'messages,' during celebrations of the sacraments, nor during other common acts of piety, nor in the Catholic media."
    
    The bishops urged the "seers" of Medjugorje to "demonstrate ecclesiastical obedience and to cease with these public manifestations and messages in this parish."
    
    Some of the Franciscan priests assigned to the Medjugorje parish, he said, have been expelled from their order because of their refusal to accept Church authority. "They have not only been illegally active in these parishes, but they have also administered the sacraments profanely, while others invalidly," he said. As Bishop of Mostar-Duvno, he said, he felt obliged to warn the faithful "who invalidly confess their sins to these priests and participate in sacrilegious liturgies." From Catholic World News – July 2006 (http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=45105).
    (Bishop Ratko Peric's homily: http://www.cbismo.hr/DHTMLFiles/Opsirnije.asp?P=25)

    Posted By: HMacK

19. Fr Peter Joseph, Chancellor of the Maronite Diocese of Australia - doctorate in dogmatic theology from the Pontifical Gregorian University, Rome, had this to say about situations such as can be applied to Medjugorje:
    "It is forbidden, as well as sinful, to propagate private revelations which have received a negative judgement from the local Bishop, the conference of Bishops, or the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith".
    "Everyone is free to have an opinion, but all have to submit to the judgement of the Church with practical obedience. What I mean is: you are still free to disagree (the Bishop is not infallible in this matter), but you owe him practical obedience, that is, you may not act against the decree; you may not propagate a revelation that the Bishop has judged negatively, or continue to say publicly that you regard it as genuine. Remember, a Church commission may give a negative verdict for reasons which it cannot state publicly, e.g., it may have found out things against the character of the seer, but will not say so publicly, even though this would justify the decision and help people to accept it.
    If a so-called message is judged not authentic for doctrinal reasons, then you are not free to defend such messages, because then you will be defending error".
    

    Posted By: Michael Webb

20. 'I have been advised that everyone should just go by what the Bishops conference and the Holy See have said - that nothing has changed since then and Medjugorje is in their hands.'
    
    Well said Frank. All are entitled to their opinions.
    
    Anyone who presumes to definitively judge the events of Medjugorje is speculating.
    
    When Cardinal Bertone says, of Bishop Peric's view, 'It is not a definitive offical judgment on the part of the Church', he is saying in black and white -the church has not yet ruled on Medjugorje . Why not take the matter up with Cardinal Bertone and Pope Benedict or better still -why not just leave it at that.

    Posted By: Skye

21. For those who froth at the mouth declaring there is schism in Medjugorje- often without ever having been to the place -I would like to say that having been there, and having lived in Sydney I would conclude there is much more of a schism here, and more opposition to our wonderful Cardinal Pell, than there should be. There is a much more truly lived Catholicism in Medjugorje, and while some may think there are apparitions and some don't (most do) there is no division on basic theological , doctrinal matters. Mass is the central event of the town - there are more than 10 daily and confession and prayer are much much more in evidence than here in Sydney. On the fundamentals there is no division. Here in sydney one wonders how many Catholics believe the Pope is the Vicar of Christ.
    
    
    Why not focus on healing the problems of oppositional clergy here, and work on the crypto Catholics in your own backyard, and leave Medjugorje to Cardinal Bertone and Pope Benedict. They have the matter in hand.

    Posted By: Skye

22. From what I know about apparitions, etc. one only needs to ask if they acknowlege Jesus as the Son of God who died to forgive the sins of mankind. Apparently, this usually forces a spiritual showdown at the OK Corral.

    Posted By: Greg

23. It's sad that people still believe in this archaic rubbish.

    Posted By: Jelly

24. No one could seriously trust Cardinal Bertone after his utter failure to handle the Fatima issue. He left that one with serious credibility problems. The more he tried to "settle" the affair the more he aroused even greater doubts about his trustworthiness. He even succeeded in turning a former ally into a convinced opponent through his apparent duplicity. His book on the matter answered none of the crucial issues concerned. He even ran away from one of the Catholic journalists, Socci, whom he had challenged beforehand who had been a former ally, that is until he had read the whole evidence for the case.
    
    When it is claimed all religions are equal in God's eyes then we know that this is an erroneous perspective made obviously fallacious by comparing its claims with Sacred Scripture and that which The Church has always taught, that is until up to the pontificate of John Paul II. Beware of false prophets with "itching ears" as St Paul forewarned us. A day will come when even the elect will be led astray by false prophets. Indeed, that day is already here. When The Christ comes again think you that He will find faith on earth?

    Posted By: HMacK

25. HMack, it is zealotry like yours that has caused much suffering throughout the world, many peace loving nations slaughtered and or indoctrinated by such men with steadfast beliefs. It is just fine for you to believe what you believe, but to shun your fellow man for following another path because of the bible says there is only 1 true path, is sheer ignorance. For one, the bible is an amalgamation of different books written by different people, at different periods throughout history, has been translated many many times over, and the fact is, most christians and catholics follow the 'king james version' of the bible, which have things in it which he added. The bible is a good guide, but it is not God. It wishes man to be peace loving and spiritual, as spirituality unites, and religion divides, which is more than obvious from your posts. Here you wish to discuss whether or not a miracle has happened in
    Medjugorge... Whether or not the Virgin Mary was indeed sighted really doesn't matter, if the people visit this place, and their faith is all the stronger, then that is a miracle worthy of mentioning in itself. Now I'm not really a religious person, I believe in a higher power, but I come from a more logical perspective. Let's not condemn each other for believing in one thing or another, let us celebrate the differences in our cultures for uniqueness is beautiful. Actions speak louder than bible thumping...

    Posted By: Annonymous

26. If it had not been for the zeal of many popes and Roman Catholics through the ages and their armies, Europe would have been islamised long ago and undeveloped today. Read your history books, not the revised protestant ones. Then there would have been no freedom to discuss such issues as these and there would have been no universities to promote the arts, humanities and sciences, among a host of other factors.
    
    The problem with liberals is that they believe it is possible to have peace without Christ. This is utterly impossible. Liberals believe that any belief is good and all are relatively acceptable. The problem is that while the liberals are making laws about what we must say and not say, the very enemies who are going to undermine the liberty given to us by Catholic civilisation are taking advantage of the liberalism afforded them and a state which has lost the necessary moral and theological guidance of the Catholic Church. Their non-Catholic zealotry will eventually deprive you of the freedom to be zealousness or not for your faith which is The Faith founded by Our Blessed Lord and no other.
    
    All religions are not equal and not all are good - animism which I experienced directly in south eastern Africa is totally evil and destructive - you obviously have never seen the effect of the demonic activities; Zoroastrianism is a fire worshiping pagan sect and inspires many of its followers with intimidatory fear; Shinto & Zen led a whole nation into the delusion it was uniquely divine and destined to rule the world; protestantism reduced Europe to civil war and now an economic system which is selfishly individualistic, materio-centric and unsustainable. The atheists are not doing much better since it was their theories about evolution and survival of the fittest that led to communist and fascist ideologies that accounted for the worst wars this planet has ever witnessed in the twentieth century. They are threatening more. What about that for zealotry? The Catholic Church was not the aggressor in any of these events.
    
    In the very near future you will be sorry that you allowed your Catholic freedom to be so undermined into believing it does not matter what you believe in.
    Pacifism was never a Catholic teaching since its many saints have taken up the sword - St Joan of Arc is an outstanding example. Unthinking pacifism leaves Christendom open to immediate danger and encourages the megalomaniac and the aggressor to exert his power. When Jesus cured the centurion's servant he did not tell him to lay down his sword and be a pacifist. It is only in the last twenty or so years churchmen are pleading the pacifist cause. Thus, Medjugorjie is not necessarily Catholic from this perspective either.
    
    There are plenty of approved places to find Our Blessed Lady and Our Blessed Lord without courting contentious apparitions that propagate ambiguities about The Faith.
    
    As for my zealotry I believe in The One Holy Catholic Apostolic Faith founded by Our Blessed Lord with St Peter as its first pope and when The Church returns to its senses about the futility of unbridled religious liberty, obsessive ecumenism, disorientating interreligious "dialogue" and horizontalist collegiality it will then be able to give the vital leadership that it has given to western Christendom over the centuries since Jesus Christ was crucified. It is this which it has almost completely lost since the 1960s in a western Christendom which has lost The Christ as its rightful Head. Thus, I have to agree with the thousands of early Christians who thought it was a church worth dying for. And I must thank all those brave Catholic soldiers who heeded the calls of many Holy Fathers to go and fight against the invading moors who almost succeeded in islamising the west, thus depriving us of what we may enjoy today.
    
    

    Posted By: HMacK

27. Please get your facts right when it comes to reporting on Medjugorje. Bishop Gemma does not speak for the Vatican

    Posted By: John Mc Carthy

28. London Tabloid Inaccurately portrayed Bishop as speaking for the Vatican against apparation and Medjugorje
    
    
    June 15, 2008 - The "news" has flashed across blogs and chain-mail lists and even onto at least one Catholic news site:
    
    Medjugorje had been condemned -- proclaimed as evil -- by the Vatican.
    
    That was the subject tag for a flood of e-mails and fodder for chat rooms around Europe and North America. The headline came from an English newspaper and said, "Vatican denounces group's claim of seeing the Virgin Mary more than 40,000 times as 'work of the devil.'"
    
    It was a dream come true for the many enemies of the alleged apparitions. Finally: the famed apparition site in Bosnia-Hercegovina, which has been drawing more pilgrims than any apparition since Fatima -- and perhaps before that (forty million since 1981) -- had been denounced, ending the debate. Vanquished.
    
    It seemed so cut and dry, with one major hitch: the report -- that it was a Vatican official -- was erroneous, disseminated in a lurid London tabloid as a sparsely detailed article that was then picked up by those bloggers and sites such as CathNews in Australia which long have hankered to give Medjugorje its comeuppance. The tabloid took it from a short interview with the bishop in an Italian magazine and hyped it into a Vatican ruling.
    
    Most major religious news sites stayed away from the story -- knowing that there had been no such pronouncement from Rome. In fact, a recent decision by the Vatican to take Medjugorje away from a negative-leaning national bishops' commission was seen as the most important positive development for the site since 1986 (when the local bishop's authority to rule on it was likewise removed when he tried to reject it).
    
    Still, there were the e-mails -- based on purported and still unconfirmed statements by Monsignor Andrea Gemma of Italy, a retired bishop-exorcist who, it was claimed, told an Italian magazine that Medjugorje is a deception that will soon be ruled against by Rome.
    
    "It is a scandal," he was quoted as saying. According to the newspaper, the Vatican will "soon crack down on the group [of seers]."
    
    But a Vatican spokesman Bishop Gemma is not -- and never was, discrediting the headline and the flurry of e-mails quoting the tabloid, which, in the tradition of British journalism, often designs headers before it finds facts to support them. First published in 1896 by Lord Northcliffe, it is Britain's second biggest-selling daily newspaper (after The Sun).
    
    Where its idea originated that this local bishop represented the Vatican was not readily apparent. According to a Church biography, Gemma served as the prelate of the Isernia-Venafro diocese from December 7, 1990 to August 5, 2006 but was never in a ranking position at the Vatican. To say one of Italy's bishops speaks for the Vatican (there are 225 dioceses, not to mention all the retired prelates) is like saying that a federal official in Pittsburgh speaks for the White House.
    
    In fact, there are no official "Vatican" exorcists. The idea that he was such apparently came from a popular secular book written by Tracy Wilkinson about exorcists in Italy and entitled -- in a way that alluded to the Church as a whole, not the Holy See -- The Vatican's Exorcists.
    
    Said the book, which featured several exorcists: "Gemma, seventy-four, speaks at times with a slow, dramatic flair, repeating his words for emphasis." It added that he was a featured speaker at a meeting of exorcists "where he regaled the priests with his stories, his eagerness to knock down the mystique around diabolical possession, and his penchant for the closest thing to irreverence that a bishop can muster when talking about Church hierarchy."
    
    Despite the fact that Rome has never said anything negative about Medjugorje -- remaining neutral, at least for now -- that freewheeling style fit neatly with The Mail's own penchant for articles that cast a negative light on the Church. Noted one English viewer (Peter Devine, of County Durham): "The Daily Mail newspaper is the Catholic Church's greatest enemy in England."
    
    The Mail was not, however, the original source. "You'll see that soon the Vatican will intervene with something explosive to unmask once and for all who is behind this deceit," the now 77-year-old bishop told Petrus, an online Italian Catholic journal.
    
    If that is ever the case, we will adhere to the verdict. The Gemma statement went on to say that the Church already has spoken through the Bishop of Mostar -- whose authority, in fact, has been stripped. That bishop long has been antagonistic to Medjugorje but his diocese lost authority over Medjugorje in 1986, rendering the idea that he speaks for the Church as another inaccuracy expressed in the Petrus interview by Gemma himself, who also erroneously stated that pilgrimages are not allowed there (despite official Vatican statements to the contrary; it has twice stated through its press office that while official parish pilgrimages are not allowed until there is Church approval, unofficial ones are allowed, including those with priests. The Cardinal of Sarajevo, who is the country's highest ecclesiastic authority, has repeated this).
    
    Might Medjugorje one day be rejected?
    
    While John Paul II was highly favorable toward the apparitions, even encouraging pilgrimages, and Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger rescued the site from local condemnation, it is not clear how Benedict will act now that he is pontiff. We will adhere to whatever the Vatican decides. Thus far, it has decided nothing. When such an announcement comes, it will be through the Vatican press office from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.
    
    Meanwhile, another priest highlighted in The Vatican's Exorcists -- the famed Father Gabriele Amorth, of Rome (who performed exorcisms with John Paul II) -- has visited Medjugorje and described it as both an authentic apparition and (ironically) a "fortress against Satan."
    
    
    

    Posted By: Ana Shawl

29. To not believe a word of Medjugorje means not to believe a word about prayer, going to Mass, fasting, reading the Bible, confession, the Eucharist. Wow, I am floored that someone would say they don't believe a word of this. If this is from the devil, then he's pathetic and converted then.
    
    This to me is like the pharisees saying that Jesus is converting and curing people by the work of the devil. I'm glad I'm not one of them.
    
    It is funny that the people who speak against Medjugorje are those that have never been there, and if they have been there, then their hearts were totally hardened to wonderful graces given.
    
    That has been happening though for thousands of years and it will keep on. All we can do is pray for all who don't believe in God or the graces that He sees fit to give.
    
    Anna

    Posted By: Anna

30. Indeed, get the facts right - because the Bishops of Mostar should be obeyed for the moment and the declaration of Rome that for the time being there should be no organised pilgrimages there. Neither should clergy be writing books pre-empting the Vatican's final decision by suggesting "constat de supernaturaliter" when in fact it is officially "non constat de supernaturaliter". People can go there privately as they can anywhere else but the other movements described are typical signs of disobedience.

    Posted By: HMacK

31. At present, to reject or accept Medjugorjie is not the point, neither is the quoted exorcist the authority. The status of the place at present is that there is no conclusive evidence of the supernatural. In any case, salvation does not depend on private revelation but on obedience to the consistent magisterial teachings of The Church. If it was not so then many more catholics would have been deluded even by demonic stigmatists. There are plenty of places we may experience the graces of The Blessed Trinity and the chosen vessel Our Blessed Lady without courting controversy and a place associated with very doubtful statements allegedly attributed to Our Blessed Mother. Frankly speaking, we do not require the sensational to live our Faith, attend the true Holy Sacrifice of The Mass, go regularly to Confession and be faithful to our vocations, whatever they are. Living The Faith is much simpler than many imagine. It does not hinge on apparitions.
    
    The fact is that many have been on official parish pilgrimages astutely called unofficial and books by clergy have been written pre-empting any Vatican decision. Many a parish bookshop is replete with paraphernalia associated with this place which try to suggest everything is authentically from The Blessed Virgin. Some even make up their own versions using personal emotional experiences which of themselves can be illusory. This is clearly in disobedience to the current official position.
    
    At a more rational level, it is when we look closely at the issues directly connected with this "apparition" one has to seriously ask whether it is not a deceit on a mass scale - comparing the apparitions of La Salette, Fatima and Atika & their outcomes with this abnormal set of circumstances which contrast considerably on many points of detail, then drawing clear conclusions in favour is very problematic indeed. Certainly, Medjugoriists have their own preferred versions which are not always very reliable.

    Posted By: HMacK

32. By the way, if anyone reads Italian, they can read about this story on the following website - it is not just a tabloid slur in a London newspaper as has been intimated on this site.
    
    
    http://www.papanews.it/dettaglio_interviste.asp?IdNews=7499#a
    

    Posted By: HMack

33. I believe that the Virgin Mary's appearances are for everyone, not just Catholics. After making several trips to Sterrett, Alabama, USA, and experiencing being in the midst of the crowd and close to Marija Lunetti (one of the Visionaries) during her Apparition, I have concluded that this is truly an authentic phenonemenon. For those who do not believe, there is nothing anyone can say to convince them. Especially those who speak but have not been there to experience this monumental happening. The Vatican will not stop the believers from believing and I hope that the others will leave the visionaries alone. They have suffered much during these years. It is plain jealousy and envy that makes people think they should not have some of the niceties of life. They totally deserve it.
    May God continue to bless them and everyone else associated. Perhaps the folks calling this the work of the devil have some of their owns demons to deal with.
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    

    Posted By: alice

34. "I have concluded that this is truly an authentic [phenomenon] phenonemenon...........The Vatican will not stop the believers from believing.................It is plain jealousy and envy that makes people think they should not have some of the niceties of life".
    
    Quod erat demonstrandum - a personal experiential preference for the "apparition" is stated as some form of reliable witness when in fact it is based on a subjective experience only; a further confirmation that Medjugorjiists will continue to go on acting according to their own wishes no matter what The Vatican says which sounds very much like an inappropriate ultimatum to Rome and, third, emotive accusations that anyone who does not believe in an apparition preselected by the same group of unquestioning enthusiasts is riven with jealousy and envy which is a rather reductionist perspective on why even the hierarchy in Rome have proceeded with utmost and necessary caution.
    
    Unfortunately, such comments reveal the psychological condition of those who try to force their own conclusions on The Church and all her faithful whether they like it or not. Thankfully, The Church has already spoken - The Faith does not depend on private revelations such as apparitions. It is for the same reasons indirectly suggested by correspondents here, it has wisely adopted this position.
    
    Subjective personal experiences, threat of continued action nevertheless and ill-aimed generalised accusations "reductio ad absurdum" are not very convincing testimonial.

    Posted By: HMacK

35. The Vatican did not ban pilgrimmages in 1985 and the Bishop was for all for Medjugorje until the Blessed Mother said he was misled in a decision he made. In fact Pope JPII said that the Bishop could NOT ban pilgrimmages there...
    
    On a side note, the taxi drivers drive Mercedes Benz there, so I'm not sure what 'expensive cars' means, but the visionaries live simple lives.

    Posted By: Kiki

36. The local Bishop always makes the final decision re a reported apparition. He enjoys this privilege by canonical right in the Church. The Holy See has acknowledged this fact in the cases of Garabandal, Bayside and Medjugorje all of which have been officially condemned by the bishops in the dioceses where these apparitions were reported. It is too bad that so many people have chosen to continue following these "apparitions" and their messages in a radical state of disobedience. Btw, acts of disobedience against a local Ordinary's decision on these types of matters is usually a sure sign that an apparition is false!
    
    We all need to pray to the Holy Spirit for the gift of discernment when it comes to reported apparitions. Following our emotions or the trends and the sensationalism spread by special-interest groups goes far beyond what the Church teaches.
    
    This should help....
    
    "Apparitions true and false":
    
    http://christianorder.com/features/features_2004/features_oct04.html
    
    Medjugorje Facts:
    
    http://www.unitypublishing.com/Apparitions/MedjugorjeIndex.html

    Posted By: John

37. You're doing a great job explaining Catholic teaching HMack!
    
    One of the visionaries came to a local parish Church and the church bulletin read this way:
    
    "Mass at 5:00 P.M. followed by apparition of Our Lady to Ivan at 6:30 sharp."
    
    What an insult to the Mother of God! Apparitions on demand with no regard for Church teaching.
    
    "All religions are equal before God." "The Gospa" almost dropping the child Jesus, the disobedience of the Franciscans to the Bishop after the Bishop had discussed removing the Franciscans with the approval of the Franciscan Superior General in Rome, and the apparition takes the side of the priests encouraging disobedience! The early lies of the children etc....40,000 apparitions and counting. My Lord, it's religious emotionalism.
    
    Let's hypothetically state that the CDF comes out and gives a negative ruling to the apparitions. Many people who have made this their entire faith will lose the faith. Many will continue believing desptie what the Vatican says, thereby making themselves their own Magisterium.
    
    Let's listen to the Church. Christ left behind an authoritative, teaching Church guided by the Holy Spirit to guide us. Let's trust that.
    
    Don't overlook the fact that this last commission was going to decide negatively until taken away by the Vatican. That's not a case of approbation of the apparitions by the Vatican. That means that this phenomena has grown so wide spread that the Vatican needs to make this ruling so that the matter will end.
    
    Also, mention has been made on here that the Church will not rule on the apparitions till they are over. Isn't it interesting they never end! Does that mean the Church can't make a ruling? Of course not.
    
    In Bayside, New York we had so called apparitions.
    Guess what was happening? Thousands coming every week to hear the latest message. People turning to the Church. saying rosaries, distributing scapulars. phenomena in the sky as at Medj.,
    Many people asked, "how can this be false? People are coming back to God, going back to Mass, praying more. It can't be false or demonic."
    
    Guess what. While the apparitions were still going on the local Bishop condemned the apparitions as false. Why? False messages, religious subjectavism, disregard for Church authority.'
    
    What does all this do? Detract our attention from the true messages of Our Lady, especially those of Fatima! Fatima, where every pronouncement of Our Lady was fulfilled, whereas none have been fulfilled at Med. Each child given ten secrets at Med.? Seventy secrets?
    
    And what to say of so many people who came away from Medjugorje and claimed they were having apparitions? If we listen to the Church the devil cannot trick us.
    
    If the Church condemns Medjugorje, which I believe its the only thing they can do considering the facts, then I pray for all those who have invested their lives and money in the so-called appartions to move forward and help promote the Truth of Faith and appartions approved of by the Church and pray the fall away may not be too many, because the devil is willing to lose a lot in order to gain a few. I pray people will stick with the Church.
    
    Books to help with regards to Apparitions.
    
    "Mystical Phenomena" by Msgr. Albert Farges
    "Graces of Interior Prayer" by Fr. Poulain.
    The works of St. John of the Cross.
    
    God bless you all and keep you.
    Joseph

    Posted By: Joseph

38. Joseph
    
    Thanks be to God.
    
    You have to undertstand the Medjugoriists make the faith up as they go along - they have invented their own legend and have duped thousands into it. Rebellion and disobedience are its watchwords. When you read the tales of various "apparitions" only the gullible would swallow them whole.
    
    If you read carefully the comments from its advocates here they all have similar character - subjective personal emotive experience employed as evidence of authenticity which, of course, demonstrates nothing objective. There is a denial that the bishop is ultimate authority for the present anyway. There are accusations that those who refuse to be as naive as they are in some way are without The Faith, and reduced to envy which is an extremely reductionist perspective and an uncharitable reaction on their part. Further, they pledge that no matter what, they will continue to believe and follow their inclinations as an ultimatum to The Vatican. Finally, Pope John Paul II (RIP) is liberally misrepresented in his views on the "apparitions" to the extent they almost make the claim he was some type of closet Medjugoriist.
    
    Our Blessed Lord has warned us to judge a tree by its fruit - its real fruit, not its appearance or by its foliage - its fruit. Not everyone who cries "Lord! Lord!" at Heaven's Gates will be permitted to enter but we shall not be judged by whether or not we believed in apparitions. In this respect, Medjugorjie which is still officially "non constat de supernaturaliter", remains irrelevant to The Roman Catholic Faith. The Faith may be found in safer, less contentious lieux.

    Posted By: HMacK

39. Medjugorje cannot be authentic when "Our Lady" condoned a censured priest's status when he defied his Bishop. Meaning that the apparition opposes a legitimate moral ruling by the Church's representative in Mostar. Lourdes and Fatima messages were always entirely subject to church rulings and approval.
    Also the 'messages" are so bland,negative and repetitive..one in particular contained a highly dubious statement that all religions are equal.
    'By their fruits you will know them'

    Posted By: T.H.OLSEN

40. I disagree with the bishop.Mary is bringing people to Jesus Christ. satan wouldn't want to do that. There are people with money who do good things with that. The visionaries were not told that they had to live the life of nuns and priests. Where is the deception in all this? Sandy
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    

    Posted By: sandy

41. ''I disagree with the bishop" - The Vatican does not! Holy Scripture does not! Sacred Tradition of The Church does not! its Canon Law does not! and its teaching on apparitions does not!
    
    "Mary is bringing people to Jesus Christ" - presumption is a sin - prove objectively that it is Mary who is. What is the real fruit of the lives converted - more disobedience to church directives on apparitions at Medjugorie? Belief that all religions are equal in God's sight? Belief in the super-dogmas of emotional protestant charismaticism? That disobedient suspended Franciscan clerics are inspired by the Holy Ghost to keep on flouting canon law? Think before you make such exaggerated subjective claims.
    
    "satan wouldn't want to do that" - Indeed he would when he can create further division as this comes from his hands; he wants Catholics to believe falsehoods and disseminate them throughout the remnant of christendom; he enjoys beguiling the vulnerable by posing as an angel in light - read St Paul on this.
    
    "There are people with money who do good things with that" - not when it promotes false apparitions with false teachings which propagate disobedience to canonically constituted ecclesiastical authority & reinforces disobedient franciscans to continue in their illicit lifestyle.
    
    "The visionaries were not told that they had to live the life of nuns and priests" - of course not because this is not a real encounter with The Blessed Virgin Mary.
    
    "Where is the deception in all this? " You do not understand fully the nature of authentic apparitions which are "constat de supernaturalitater". The stories of some of the supposed visions are totally un-Catholic and absurdities to any rational Catholic witness. But to those who do not comprehend the essence of Roman catholic teaching on apparitions and who do not know their faith very well then they are vulnerable to following deception. I challenge you to read Michael Davies' book and to read the Bishops of Mostar on these signs of disobedience, outright rebellion and ultimate deception.

    Posted By: HMacK

42. Medjugorje is Satanic says
    Andrea Gemma, 77, a bishop.
    
    I am so glad we have Father or Bishop Gemma's ruling. We don't have to wait for the Vatican to approve or disapprove it. It seems he is smarter than Pope John Paul 2 who told the local bishop to form another committee when he ruled it false on multiple occasions. It seems to me the dogmatic statement should get the good bishop in hot water with the powers that be in the Vatican as he is usurping the voice of those who are in authority to resolve this matter. His opinion is just that and is not binding on me. I believe in Our Lady Queen of Peace and her messages are all good and not against the bible or the church. Thank God He has allowed Mother Mary to stay so long.

    Posted By: Michael Shannon

43. I believe medjugorje to be a hoax. The Blessed Virgin Mary would not keep reappearing when those appearances are causing so much disruption and lack of peace within her Son's, our Lords Church here on earth. Nor would she use Franciscans who had been kicked out of their religious order and who had their faculties to say Mass and hear Confessions removed. Nor would she want those she chose to act in disobedience to the magisterium of her Son's Church. Whatever you bind on earth will be bound in Heaven and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in Heaven. Whatever the magisterium decides we should follow. The Bishop has the authority to make decisions for his diocese which he did and the Visionaries and Ex Fransicans chose to disobey him publicly. That in itself is a scandal in the Church. I am sure the Holy Mother doesn't condone scandal in the Church. Many may feel that they have been brought to the Church and they may be attending Catholic Masses but do they really believe what they say they do in the Creed during every Mass? Do they really believe in the Catholic Faith and all that the Catholic Church teaches? Or is the devil doing his work to destroy the church through them? Are they doing Jesus's work or the devil'swork.

    Posted By: Bev

44. Having spent thirteen months in Bosnia during the war I experienced first hand the duplicity of some elements of the Croatian Catholic community and particularly the underhand and sometimes criminal influence of Franciscan priests in Jace as well as Medugorge. This whole affair make a ridicule of our Church in the eyes of many. It is a falsehood and a dangerous one at that.

    Posted By: Eoin O'Eihim

45. The news just out is that Benedict XVI has authorised ‘severe cautionary and disciplinary measures’ against Father Tomislav Vlasic, the former ‘spiritual director’ to six children who said Our Lady was appearing to them at Medjugorje in Bosnia.
    
    The Franciscan priest has been suspended after he refused to co-operate into claims of scandalous sexual immorality ‘aggravated by mystical motivations’.
    
    www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1052230/Pope-finally-launches-crackdown-worlds-largest-illicit-Catholic-shrine-suspends-dubious-priest.html?printingPage=true
    
    More news to come.
    
    Roman Catholics who know their Faith and what it truly teaches consistently in its perpetual magesterium, recognise that Medjugorie is a global hoax perpetrated by disobedient rebellious franciscans who have manipulated alleged visionaries. This is a disgraceful fraud and perhaps the worst ever inflicted on the Catholic Church.
    It is utterly delusional and encourages its followers into heresy and schismatic behaviour. It is time to close the show down: it is just not Roman Catholic.

    Posted By: HMacK

46. BECAUSE OF MY TWO PILGRIMAGES TO MEDJUGORJE MY FAITH HAS INCREASED 10-FOLD. I DECIDED TO PURSUE RELIGIOUS EDUCATION INSTEAD OF LAW SCHOOL AND HENCE HAVE TAUGHT THEOLOGY AT THE SECONDARY LEVEL FOR EIGHT YEARS AND HAVE COMPLETED A MASTER'S DEGREE IN THEOLOGY IN THE CATHOLIC TRADITION. I FIND THIS ARTICLE TO BE CLOSE MINDED, IGNORANT AND FRANKLY UNCHRISTIAN IN SPIRIT.

    Posted By: Matthew Scalzo

47. The presumption you make that Medjugorie is authentic because you have had certain personal experiences of a professional nature is not an objective demonstration of "constat de supernaturalitater". The Church has made it absolutely clear that there is no evidence at all of the supernatural and supports the Bishop concerned. The Franciscan priests most associated with this sorry saga have behaved in scandalous ways that do nothing at all to enhance belief in the supposed authenticity of the countless "apparitions".
    
    I can recall deciding to marry my wife following a pilgrimage to Walsingham and we have subsequently had 5 children. We have also been to Lourdes and to Fatima. These are officially "constat de supernaturalitater". The Vatican approves totally and there is no disobedience implied by going.
    However, our Roman Catholic Faith did not depend on our pilgrimages nor on the apparitions of these holy places. Our Faith and our response to the divine and sovereign Will of God is based on obedience to the consistent teachings of The Church which also embrace very clear statements on attaching too much importance to apparitions.
    
    Furthermore, it is a polite convention when we blog not to use upper case fonts all the way through as this is deemed as a scripted form of shouting. Sound, authentic and clear statements about The Faith are acceptable but shouting based on subjective personal experiences of alleged apparitions is less so.

    Posted By: HMacK

48. I AM UTTERLY BAFFLED BY AN EX VATICAN PERSON & AN EXORCIST CLAIMS THAT THE APPARITIONS AT MEDJOUGORIE ARE NOT REAL.IT IS A PITY THE RELIGIOUS & MORE SO AN EX VATICAN PERSON, INSTEAD OF STRENGTHENING THE FAITH OF PEOPLE & THE CATHOLIC CHURCH, IS DOING JUST THE OPPOSITE.THE EX VATICAN PERSON NEEDS HELP DESPERATELY AS HE SEEMS TO BE IN THE CLUTCHES OF THE EVIL ONE.SAD TO MENTION HIS FAITH HAS SHAKEN & DESTROYED. PLEASE DO NOT DISILLUSION THE WORLD .THE APPARITIONS ARE VERY TRUE AND REAL. OUR BLESSED MOTHER WOULD NOT WASTE HER TME APPEARING TO THE 6 SEERS WITHOUT REASON.OUR PRIESTS & RELIGIOUS NEED PRAYERS & HELP THE MOST AS THEY ARE BEING ATTACKED BY SATAN IN LARGE NUMBERS, & MANY PRIESTS ARE IN HELL.

    Posted By: gemma fernandes

49. Unfortunately Gemma,blogging in impolite upper case font, which is tantamount to shouting, and your own unsubstantiated personal opinions which are totally subjective, do not provide any demonstrable evidence favouring proof of the supernatural - Listen to what The Vatican is really telling you - "non constat de supernaturalitater". Those who damage the faith are those in rebellion against it and against properly constituted authority, not manipulative, exploitative and immorally behaving Franciscan priests. The real evidence is there for you to see - open your eyes and look.

    Posted By: HMacK

50. Mary and Jesus currently are appearing to people all over the world. If the Vatican is so concerned, then why don't they put these people through polygraph tests? Also, why doesn't the Vatican account for many miraculous cures that happen? The Vatican is so quick to judge. IMO, if there are cures happening at sites such as medjugorie, then it has to be AUTHENTIC. BTW, the devil would not be handing out good deeds (cures, etc) Duh.

    Posted By: Kim

51. Kim,
    
    We do not need polygraph tests. What is more important is we need to know intimately well our Roman Catholic Faith. This tells us all we need to understand to get to Heaven.
    Contentious "apparitions" will not succeed in doing what the authentic Catholic Faith does. The signs of Medjugorjie are clear - division which is of the Devil The Bible tells us so; disobedience which is a serious sin - so grave that St Benedict says without obedience we cannot enter Heaven; rebellion by a key Franciscan who has behaved in a shockingly immoral manner impregnating a nun and another who is being sanctioned by The Pope himself. Neither has been repentant.
    
    What more does The Church have to tell you to understand - "Non constat de supernaturalitater"? Misbehaving Franciscans who have brought disgrace upon themselves and upon their Patriarch St Francis and countless banal at best, and at worst fraudulent messages to children who were acting in the first place out of disobedience to their parents by smoking and not doing what they had been expected to do. I doubt very much if Our Blessed Mother would wish to be seriously associated with such outrageous behaviour which is implicit in the Medjugojie package. Neither would She speak out against a bishop as one of the alleged seers claims, who is the properly constituted authority in The CHurch to make the decision for the time being that at Medjugojie there is nothing supernatural only the spirit of disobedience.
    
    And still you go on believing in this patent sham.

    Posted By: HMacK

52. My friend saw the sun spinning and God gave him faith. Thousands have been healed. Thousands have gone to Confession. I receive Our Lady's message in e mail. Lots of bishops have been there. People have been given a deeper prayer life and now ENJOY living in GOD'S PRESEMCE
    

    Posted By: Madeleine B Furth

53. "My rosary changed from silver to gold." Is that the ultimate vindication?
    
    Your rosary isn't gold; the oil from your fingers tarnished the cheap metal used to hold the beads.

    Posted By: M. G. Hysell

54. I cannot believe that any Medjugorje enthusiast has any authentic respect or reverence for the Mother of God. At best the moral qualities the seers themselves attribute to their vision, whom they claim to be the mother of God, involve a being (or fantasy or hoax) who is emotionally insecure, capricious, ignorant of human history, subservient to the seers, obedient to the seers, snottily dismissive of church authority, snottily dismissive of church doctrine, and venomously uncharitable and threatening towards those exercising their Catholic and moral obligation to be skeptical of any claimed apparition. When our lives are over and we have to give an accounting, do we really think Jesus is going to be thrilled if we in any way gave support, actively or passively, to a phenomenon that depicted his mother as a shrew?

    Posted By: Edward

55. I just wanted to comment about a few things about your article.
    
    The message discussed which states, "All religions are equal before God..." was originally translated wrong. (Remember the language spoken in Medjugorje is Croatian and when this message was translated into English it was translated incorrectly.) The real message is:
    
    
    All religions are dear to my son. It is you on earth who are divided. We are all children of God. The Moslems and the Orthodox for the same reason as Catholics are equal before my son and me.
    
    All religions are NOT equal. All MEN are equal before God.
    
    It does not suffice to belong to the Catholic Church to be saved. It is necessary to respect and obey the commandments of God in following one’s conscience. Those who are not Catholics are no less creatures made in the image of God and destined ultimately to live in the house of God. Salvation is available to everyone without exception. Only those who refuse God deliberately are condemned by their own choice.
    (emphasis added)
    
    As far as your comments about their houses, cars, etc. The visionaries house pilgims in their homes. It would be like your entire family living in one bedroom and serving anywhere from 30 -- 200 people in your house every day of the year. They cook and clean up after each pilgrim.
    
    The tennis courts you mention were a donation.
    
    The cars they drive, as well as the rest of the town of Medjugorje, cabdrivers included are BMW's. Which is a foreign made car for us. However in Europe it is not foreign so it would be equivilent to driving a Ford.
    
    Fasting on bread and water on Wednesdays and Fridays are what they did in Jesus' time. The Church has only recently stopped this tradition.
    
    The 5 main messages of Medjugorje are
    1. Prayer with the heart: the Rosary
    2. Eucharist
    3. Holy Bible
    4. Fasting
    5. Monthly Confession
    
    If this apparition was from satan, why would he point the faithful to the Sacraments and more intense prayer lives?
    

    Posted By: Katie

56. "All religions are dear to my son."
    
    patent nonsense - hinduism cannot be "dear" as it is polytheistic and encourages belief in reincarnation. It also denigrates half of humanity as untouchable. Zoroastrianism is clearly a fire-worshipping and pagan religion that could never be dear to Our Blessed Lord, nor His Mother. Animism which I have personal experience of in Africa evidently incites demonic forces which can be devastating in certain communities.
    
    The idea that all religions are dear to Christ and, therefore, in some way egalitarian in the face of His affections is so erroneous as to be thoroughly ridiculous. It is time to wake up from such a delusion.
    
    As for the rest - go to a nice quiet place with a waterfall and if you get down on your knees with your Rosary you will feel the presence of The Lord all around you. Obey the Church and treat such apparitions as "non constat de supernaturalitater". Obedience in this case is a worthier virtue than putting trust in controversial and often un-Catholic behaviours.
    
    If conversion is the fruit of dubious apparitions which make dubious pronouncements then it is not an authentic experience. Once Medjugorie is exposed definitively as a fraud which it is, then many of its followers may well suffer immense disappointment leading to scepticism and lossof what faith they may possess. Faith requires firmer roots than this as the sower and his seed will reveal.
    
    The Church has spoken - listen.

    Posted By: HMacK

57. For over 25 years I have objectively analysed the Medjugorje Mystery and reported phenomena. My conclusion is this:
    
    The phenomena reported by people from so many countries are definitely not random in nature. They are connected and match perfectly into a
    pre existing old Framework or Design!
    
    It is remarkable, unexpected, and there is no doubt. I have all the information, and want to write a book to demonstrate the existence of this astonishing hidden Pattern. It is easy to understand, once revealed.
    
    You may email me for general information on this.
    
    Also, if you are a well known author - please communicate. This is the genuine SOLUTION to the mystery! Let's collaborate for a book. This information needs to be disseminated globally.
    
    Neil Harrington: Email: chezneil@hotmail.com
    (Australia)

    Posted By: Neil Harrington

58. To Mr. HMack, it is obvious that you have formed an opinion based on a great deal of misinformation, not the least of which is that God does repeat his message: "He says it once and if people do not listen then He gets on with His intentions." Simply by making such an erroneous statement, it is obvious that you have never read either Testament. In both, God, through the prophets, and the Lord Jesus in his own words and through his Apostles, call sinful people to repentance. If He had simply gotten on with His intentions, the world would have paid dearly by now.
    
    The Pharisees and other "Temple Leaders" of Jesus' day acted a great deal like you, sir. They formed opinions based on their own prejudices and never considered the good fruits of Jesus' ministry.
    
    I have been to Medjugorje many times and have had the privilege of hearing confessions there and of bringing back to the practice of the Sacraments MANY people who had fallen away from their faith for DECADES. I ask you, sir, how can this be diabolical? Is it not rather diabolical that people have decided a priori that the apparitions are false without any real prayerful discernment?
    
    I began as a real skeptic regarding Medjugorje. But regarding the objections you raise: houses, gift shops and the like-have you ever been to Fatima and Lourdes? Lord, save us, they are as commercial as they can be.
    
    I pray for you and for all of us. The official Papal tradition regarding private revelation is, as I understand it, that it is better to believe than not to believe. If it turns out to be true and has borne good fruit in your life, so much the better. However, if it turns out not to be true and you have still, in good faith, converted your life, you will have gained by the conversion.
    
    The real truth of the matter is that whether it is Medjugorje, Lourdes, Fatima or whatever, it is NOT the apparition which is to be preached. The Gospel of Our Lord Jesus Christ is to be preached AND INCULCATED. It is very clear by your rhetoric, that you have not inculcated the Gospel's message of mercy, repentance and, most of all, love.
    
    May God forgive me for my judgement of you. Please pray (with an open heart) for me and all priests and people of God that we may follow HIS will and not our own.

    Posted By: Fr. John

59. The Medjugorje apparitions are often said to produce wonderful results in pilgrims: they return to the Church, they receive Communion and confess frequently, pray the rosary. Rather than "proof" of transformation, such renewed activities may be called an increase in "acts of piety." They are not, per se, signs of greater virtue or of a true conversion of heart--which is shown by greater charity towards one's neighbors, a change in values, priorities, lifestyle. After all, some of the most fervent "prayers" in Church history have been heretics.

    Posted By: Dan Mattimore

60. Nonsense!
    
    Medjugorje is the fulfilment of Fatima.
    Convert, read the bible----pray and fast.
    The holy one is here.

    Posted By: susanht

61. Many people have come closer to God, the Church, and one another - including myself. I went to this holy place in July of 1994. I assure you that the devil would not be happy about saving souls!!

    Posted By: deb eiserle

62. Mary brought Jesus into the world once. Maybe she is doing so again through what is happening at Medjugorje right now. It certainly wouldn't hurt to be patient, to pray and do what we can to work for peace in the world and in our own hearts. If Mary really is appearing and we criticise and condemn, then ....well, I wouldn't like to hurt my mum.

    Posted By: Neal

63. The mother of Jesus is dead and will not be making any appearances before the Day of Judgement.

    Posted By: Herzeg

64. Sounds like a bit of jealousy.
    Why shouldn't the economy of the area get a boost? Why shouldn't the seers have a way to make a living? Note, one is married to a FORMER beauty queen (who was converted from that kind of life).
    You can still go to Fatima & Lourdes and see commercial sales of trinkets & statues. Pilgrimages, lodging houses & hotels are there to accommodate the many visitors that flock there from all over the world.
    So if Medjugorje is condemned, then condemn Fatima & Lourdes, and all the other Marian shrines around the world. That is what the devil wants, isn't it?

    Posted By: Gayle Ponseti

65. Many comments on this article make reference to good events and results of a positive religious nature being indicative of Medjugorje's authenticity.
    Statements saying the devil doesn't want conversions and he wouldn't encourage prayer display spiritual vulnerability. Many occasions have occurred, and are documented, where the devil mounted counter apparitions, which eventually were exposed down the track, by bad spiritual fruits. I would say that at the least caution is required, as the fruits on view at the moment aren''t very choice. If you hang your hat on spiritual experiences you open yourself up to great disappointment at best, and spiritual destruction at worst. When one goes fishing the worm looks good and true to the fish, often times the spiritual hook is well consealed. Beads can turn gold via heaven or hell, we have the Church to discern the difference. The Vatican is now taking action, put aside personal preferences and wait on Mother Church, children are often impulsive about that which they perceive is for their good only to find Mother knows best. Another point to remember is in any approved apparition disobedience is never present. St Faustina obeyed her superior and her confessor in a matter that Christ had requested and she was praised by Jesus for having obeyed those placed over her. To have done otherwise would have been seriously sinful. Where obedience is subverted the Shining Darkness is present. H Mack is only defending Church teaching and methods of discernment that she uses, he is not against the Church he seeks to zealously defend out of love for God and Church.

    Posted By: Con

66. When will it stop,just look at the fruits of medjugorje. 2007. 35000 priest celebrated mass at medjugorje,, nearly one and a half million hosts given to the faithfull, yet work of the.devil, some say. My granddaughter went with me a year ago, and she asked: "Are we going to pray the whole day or what?" But when we were there, she wanted Mass every day, and rosery every night. She said: "I have never prayed so much in my life and felt that good. So it was a disappointment when we came to Australiathat none of her Catholic friends knew the rosery, or even how to pray. I just keep praying she wont be getting dragged back in her old habits but mother Mary got hold of her there in medjugorje, and will keep her under her mantle. I would say don't worry about us who love medjugorje, don't worry at all ,be patient, the pope will approve medjugorje, but in God's time, not ours or yours, but his. God bless all of you

    Posted By: wilhelmina

67. There is a reason that the Catholic church has renounced Medjugorje. Read revelations, Medjugorje is the prostitute of Babylon, and Sudac, which means "Judge", "from the tribe of Dan", is the Antichrist with the wound on his forehead. It is clear as daylight.

    Posted By: John

68. I would like to reply to HMack. Pope John Paul did not visit Medjugorje because it is not approved by the Catholic Church and can never be until the apparitions have ceased. However, on his visit to the Balkans, he did request the broadcasters from radio Mir (the Medjugorje radio station based in Medjugorje) to broadcast his visit to Zadar in Croatia. This they did. Why would he have done that when he could have hired radio staff from the city of Zadar itself?
    
    People also talk about the money-making scams of Medjugorje. I have been there myself 4 times and on the third occasion stayed for six weeks! I saw the sun spin with my own eyes and can assure you that while Medjugorje has benefited financially from pilgrim visits, the vast majority of money given by pilgrims to the parish is spent by the parish in the many communities that have been set up there. There are communities to help drug addicts and alcoholics get back to God and recover from addiction. There is also what is called 'Mother's village', which was set up to look after the literally thousands of orphans created by the civil war there. These children would otherwise remain destitute as the state cannot look after them. If this is what people call Medjugorje operating a money-making scam then shame on them! I could go on but I simply do not have time unfortunately.

    Posted By: Paul Heary

69. Let the Holy Spirit of Light convict these false seers. The interview with Father Gabreille Amorth is doctored: it is a false fabrication from the proponents of this "demonically infested" propoents of the seers and all held in the spell of the devil who are leading so many astray. The Queen of Peace has always been from the beginning of Christianity and is not new. What is new is this diabolical infestation on the truth to make it seem as new, mir mir mir, in the clouds has always been a deception like the cigarettes these seers where smoking when these feelings were invented. How are these seers leading the flock astray? Look at the fruit of their lives: nothing about Marian humility but always about false pride, hatred (for those who judge there actions), lies, and sinful living in their own spiritual directors. That is not from the Queen of Peace, the mother of the Prince of Peace but from the Prince of Lies, Sin, and Pride: the Devil. Keep your eye on Christ and His apointed good and true shepherd, our Holy Father the Pope, the Magisterium, the local appointed Bishops and ArchBishops and not on any other including Cardinal Bertone. Pax Domini.

    Posted By: Velazquez, J

70. Have you not been informed that Sister Lucia, the sole survivor of the three Fatima children, has said that Medjugorje is the completion of Fatima? Investigate that for yourselves.
    
    Why are many of you detractors so angry? Why are you so rude to the supporters be they Cardinals or the laity? Where is your love of neighbour in your harsh words?
    
    Have you not read:
    1 John 4:15 "If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in him and he in God."
    
    and
    
    1 John 4:16 "...God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in him."
    
    The supporters of Medjugoje can take comfort in these passages, for, even if Medjugorje should be declared false, God is with them due to their faith in Jesus and their love; both of which are incredibly intensified through their Medjugorje experiences, whether they have been there in person or not.
    
    The thing I most notice about people who have been touched positively by Medjugorje, is the love emanating from them - love for God, love for others. (This is especially noticable in Priests.)
    Also a heightened devotion to the sacraments, deeper prayer life, an interest in the bible and catchism, and unshakeable faith.
    
    The things I notice about most Medjugorje detractors are anger, derision and a "holier than thou" attitude. They sound as if they are determined to destroy the joy of those hearts full of love and new-found confidence in God.
    
    Unfortunately for you detractors, you will never destroy the love and joy in the hearts of us supporters. We know what we have received through Medjugorje. Do you remember the Papal quote, "for those with faith no explanation is necessary, for those without faith, no explanation is possible." Remember also, that Sister Faustina was condemned for decades before this fibally was reversed and ratified, and she herself declared a saint.
    
    You detractors quote only negative, and sometimes factually incorrect, reports. Have any of you seen the very recent article about Medjugorje by the Archbishop of Dublin? It starts, "What is so wonderful about Medjugorje is..."
    
    From the Apostle John, at 1 John 4: 1-3, we have a test to apply which, happily, Medjugorje passes with flying colours: "Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God.... This is how you can recognise the Spirit of God: every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God.."
    
    Remember also that we have been called to love:
    
    1 John 4:7-8 "Dear friends, let us love one another for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God..."
    
    and
    
    1 John 3: 18 "Dear children, let us not love in with words or tongue, but with actions and in truth."
    
    We have been called to love, by Jesus and by his Apostles. In Medjugorje we receive a fullness of heart which makes this call irresistable. Harsh words and polished arguments are powerless against this gift we have received from God. We are called to pray for our brothers and our enemies. Whichever you are, we are called to pray for you.
    
    Do you pray for us? No need to focus intellectual arguments and your fear that we are being deceived. Don't worry, for, as the bible tells us, even if we are being deceived, the deceivers will be punished. In the meantime we live with glad hearts, thankful for all the gifts we have received through Medjugorje.
    
    
    
    

    Posted By: Diane

• » Advertise in CathNews

Email to Friend Please fill out the following details (fields marked with a * are mandatory):
Send To Email Address*:
Send To Name *:
Sent By Email Address*:
Sent By Name *:
Text to include in email:
Captcha validation:	please enter the code above:

^ Page Top

Comment on this article

More from this section

1. WYD pilgrims shun luxury

   Luxury Sydney hotels are bracing for a "potential disaster" as WYD pilgrims opt to sleep in backpackers and budget rooms or to sleep on school floors.

2. Catholics getting older and fewer attending Mass: NCLS

   The latest snapshot of church life in Australia shows that Mass attenders are on average older, better educated and more likely to be female, married and born overseas than Catholics in general.

3. Blair faith foundation to fight religious extremism

   Warning that there are "elements of extremism" in every religion, former British Prime Minister Tony Blair launched his Faith Foundation at a New York news conference.

4. Vinnies not at odds with WYD

   Vinnies has moved quickly to dispel a report that it is at odds with WYD organisers over meals for the homeless during next month's international event.

5. Vatican seeks to throw light on "difficult obedience"

   The Holy See Congregation for Institutes of Consecrated Life and Societies of Apostolic Life has published a new instruction on authority and obedience for religious men and women.